neuro
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Re: Imbalance with attributes

Wed Apr 11, 2018 5:02 pm

Balancing a game with payment elements is impossible.

That there are players who spend money on the game is positive, because the other players can play for free without having to spend money.

The problem is that there is a big difference between paying and not paying.

On my main server there was a player with level 40 when the second player with the highest server level was 35 ...

Now there are players who buy a hero, and in 7 days they have it in level 45 ...

Spending money must grant some kind of benefit or privilege, but unfortunately in this game money replaces effort and sacrifice.

Before collecting resources, you must be very active, now you do not need to attack cities because you have 20 guard towers

I'm also surprised that in the store you can see level 13 gold troops at a cost of 300 dollars ... when in 5 days you can have the same unit collecting resources from the guard towers ... it's pretty ridiculous.

And the turtle is also a big problem. No defense can withstand a rocket attack with nora at level 45 and maximum technology ... A level 1 gold turtle is the same as another level 13 turtle ... it gives the same bonus.
 
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Destination
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Re: Imbalance with attributes

Wed Apr 11, 2018 5:17 pm

1. balancing a game with payment elements is possible, and i think if the hero stats in duels would be removed(or changed) the game is fairly balanced at lvl 40(before speed up is indeed a huge deal).

2. having heros at a high lvl is an advantage, but i dont think it is that big. If it would be any less it would not be worth anymore to spend money on getting them there. You are perfectly fine if you get the 2-3 main heros for your race to a good lvl.

3. if money does not replace effort, what would you actually buy with it then?

4. You can deny your enemys resources from their guard tower by just plundering them, then they in return will have to attack to get resources. Or they dont and can not progress.

5. It is a good thing that those gold troops cost 300 dollar, because if they would be around 10-30 a whale could buy as much as he would want to all the time which would really make the game unbalanced.

6. I think if people get further into the temple and figure out what to do with the garrison, attacks will not be as easy as they seem to be right now anymore.
 
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Re: Imbalance with attributes

Wed Apr 11, 2018 6:34 pm

Destination wrote:
3. if money does not replace effort, what would you actually buy with it then?


Now this is getting interesting.

I totally agree that money should replace effort, BUT this has to go both ways:
effort should replace money as well.

Meaning: a skilled and super active player should be able to compete with players who prefer to cash up instead.

And this is the main problem of the game right now: no matter what you do, you simply can not compete.

You can buy attribute or skill points for money, otherwise there is a random chance in void, the shop & dungeons, but apart from this you can do as many duels or siege hits as you like, it does not matter. the same goes for potions, skill points, heroes, troop & building rush.

The currency which should point out a skilled player is obviously honor (except for the abuse of farming alt account walls).

So, in my opinion a new honor shop is badly needed (buying items over and over to hope for this 1% chance of getting flawless divine items feels ridiculous).

Even if the absurd 30% buffs for attributes do get removed and a hero cap for duels does get added, it will be the same once the castle 50 patch hits:
big spenders will be at 45 to 50 instantly and then again: super active non whales can do whatever they want without standing a chance for a very long time.

If I was a whale, I would get pretty bored in case I run out of opponents and this is exactly what happens:
low spenders quit since they have no chance to compete, whales probably stay, but get way less active since there is nothing fun to do (unless you count bashing opponents who don't stand a chance to even injure one of your units as fun).
 
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Destination
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Re: Imbalance with attributes

Wed Apr 11, 2018 6:41 pm

To some extend super skilled player can beat people that pay money, I am not talking about those 50k + whales but rather about smaller ones. Someone that spend 2-6k maybe a bit more can be defeated. Besides speed up which is a problem in itself I'd say that if you remove stats from duels the game is already decently balanced.

Besides that I agree that it should go in both direction(though if it's all about just grinding things I am not a big fan).
 
neuro
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Re: Imbalance with attributes

Wed Apr 11, 2018 6:47 pm

No one really knows how statistics affect troops. All are assumptions. You can have 1000 damage and your opponent 250, but if the maximum damage you can have in PVP is 30%, the tortoise will give the same percentage of statistics as your opponent if he does not use a turtle.

For a dwarf it is enough because they only need 30 or 40 seconds to kill you.

Having heroes with a lot of level is more important than objects and statistics if you fight against a player with heroes with less level than yours.

Elena at level 45 reduces magical damage by 55%. Jaq at level 50, gives 42% of life to the mechs. Gan at level 45, gives 65% more life to the scorpions.

If you are human and you have Gan at level 50, the hero will have no effect on your troops, but if you have Avalon, yes.

Do not you think it's a big advantage? ... high-level heroes are better than the academy in terms of damage and life...

Now it is not possible to do anything. The game has stalled. The company does not want the players to be destroyed, they do not want more mergers with new servers.

It is true, the temple in the future will make the walls are indestructible and will only make sense for those who open 2 or 3 chests of 3000 coins every 24 hours.
 
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jemmos
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Re: Imbalance with attributes

Wed Apr 11, 2018 7:15 pm

Blacklegionary wrote:
jemmos wrote:
I advise the use of strategy in this case. I never use my full hero compliment, and am constantly 200-700 points below stats. This is a good example.
https://youtu.be/IhO7SLcy5RQ

You were winning because Spider hard counter those troops. In fact, back in the days when people didn't abuse Virion so much like they are now, a full horse formation would rollover yours even with disadvantage in attribute



yes, that called stratagy. know your oponents, know yourself, and you need not fear the outcome of a 1000 battles. And I use a similar strat vs horses. however, I do have one battle that was vs a human, one of the hardest i've had in a long time. I'll post that for you.

https://youtu.be/BF9d35DWuWY
blind fight, had no idea was going against full golds, or that the guy was prepaird for litch. so my unit placement is off.
Last edited by jemmos on Wed Apr 11, 2018 7:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
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Destination
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Re: Imbalance with attributes

Wed Apr 11, 2018 7:41 pm

neuro wrote:
No one really knows how statistics affect troops. All are assumptions. You can have 1000 damage and your opponent 250, but if the maximum damage you can have in PVP is 30%, the tortoise will give the same percentage of statistics as your opponent if he does not use a turtle.

For a dwarf it is enough because they only need 30 or 40 seconds to kill you.

Having heroes with a lot of level is more important than objects and statistics if you fight against a player with heroes with less level than yours.

Elena at level 45 reduces magical damage by 55%. Jaq at level 50, gives 42% of life to the mechs. Gan at level 45, gives 65% more life to the scorpions.

If you are human and you have Gan at level 50, the hero will have no effect on your troops, but if you have Avalon, yes.

Do not you think it's a big advantage? ... high-level heroes are better than the academy in terms of damage and life...

Now it is not possible to do anything. The game has stalled. The company does not want the players to be destroyed, they do not want more mergers with new servers.

It is true, the temple in the future will make the walls are indestructible and will only make sense for those who open 2 or 3 chests of 3000 coins every 24 hours.


I have a lvl 50 Avalon and a lvl 50 yip, my virion is 49 and my Vega 45, Elena is 43 right now have not been lvling her. These are basically the only heros you really need when playing human(other races need even less sometimes) The only thing that I really bought in the game was patron(I also bought the first hero and another one later, but that does not help me at all with lvling them) I can not call myself a F2P player anymore sadly but as you can see it is very well possible to have decent heros without being a whale. And I am not even the person with the best heros on my server(sunbow for example got better ones)
 
neuro
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Re: Imbalance with attributes

Wed Apr 11, 2018 9:08 pm

Having many heroes is only useful in PVP. I do not think you have many problems to destroy human and dwarf defenses, regardless of the territory in which they are and with the maximum technology. On my server there are many whales of many types and all are destroyed, except 1 dwarf. Each time he is attacked, he loses more than 60k of minerals (mechs and tanks).
 
Blacklegionary
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Re: Imbalance with attributes

Wed Apr 11, 2018 11:38 pm

jemmos wrote:


yes, that called stratagy. know your oponents, know yourself, and you need not fear the outcome of a 1000 battles. And I use a similar strat vs horses. however, I do have one battle that was vs a human, one of the hardest i've had in a long time. I'll post that for you.

https://youtu.be/BF9d35DWuWY
blind fight, had no idea was going against full golds, or that the guy was prepaird for litch. so my unit placement is off.


I wouldn't say you won because of strategy. It was rather because your opponents were born of the Guard Tower era and lack the basic knowleage of PvP in the early days and that doesn't proves that attribute don't cause imbalance. We can just do a simple math and see how imbalance they are. I'd only be convinced if you manage to beat VoodooChild

Btw, I seriously think that the Turtles should only boost Rakan units' stats as they generally have lower stats than other races. Giving the boost to other races kinda taking away their perk.
 
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Niquette
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Re: Imbalance with attributes

Thu Apr 12, 2018 5:55 am

Agree with Destination, i m FTP player. Only pay patron and i have Denji 50 and à lot closer to the max. Since i have Denji at max, Rakan become playable so hero change à lot of thing.
Ofc pay will help you but my biggest problem right now is luck.
There was included à lot of content in game, but everything governed by luck. If you have no luck and dont have weapon unlock in stage 81 you will have big gap with the players Who have it. If you have the wrong rune idem...I always open my hero chest and get one at the guaranteed hero, some won just by openning one, so im out for pvp... The gap btw players most part cause of luck... The biggest problem is that luck should be focus toward the race and hero you played. And reduce all content managed by luck. That is the biggest pb not ptw players. If they want spent their money, i let them did, but i prefer better challenge. :P.
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