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Re: Cheat bombarders ability open fire.

Posted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 8:26 pm
by Lolix
neuro wrote:
Lolix wrote:
It's roughly similar though no?
Mech is 25 per unit while scorpions are 28
Spiders are 15 while bombardiers are 16


The most common (48 gold rockets = 96 gold army cap) x (20 silver mechs = 100 army silver cap) x (6 gold spiders x 100 gold army cap) x (35 silver scorpions = 140 silver army cap). The dwarves use less gold army cap to attack and can build more troops. If you add that a level 50 jaq has a damage like 16 gold rockets and that it gives almost 50% more life to the mechs, you already have the answer because the dwarves are so strong.

If the rockets are the scorpions in the conversion of troops, it does not make sense that a scorpion has 4 of army cap and a rocket 2, nor does it make sense that a tank has 20, a spider 15, and a turtle 35.


Am I mistaken or are spiders not 15 gold cap each? Making 6 cost 90 and not 100. Which sort or mess up your point. Not only have I seen few lvl 50 jacques even on whales but I have definitely not seen them do the dmg of 2 bombardiers. You are also comparing front line costs and dps troop costs.. what will you suggest next? That because rockets happen to be the equivalent of scorps then scorpions should do the same dps? Tanks occupy 15 cap and not 20 where are you getting your numbers from?


@Behindtheed.

Considering your mind boggling reasoning behind a 20% bonus being in fact 40% I suspect it is you who lives in another dimension. By that standard humans constantly operate on a 40% bonus. Except that they don't. They just have a 20% bonus more frequently than The others do. The normal state is without a bonus which is then applied when the battlefield is chosen. Grassland is not a default it is a choice by both parties and also depends largely in which kingdom the cities are being contended.

Re: Cheat bombarders ability open fire.

Posted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 9:01 pm
by Behindtheed
Lolix wrote:
@Behindtheed.

Considering your mind boggling reasoning behind a 20% bonus being in fact 40% I suspect it is you who lives in another dimension. By that standard humans constantly operate on a 40% bonus. Except that they don't. They just have a 20% bonus more frequently than The others do. The normal state is without a bonus which is then applied when the battlefield is chosen. Grassland is not a default it is a choice by both parties and also depends largely in which kingdom the cities are being contended.


Grass is the largest terrain type on the map, and thus the most likely location for a battle by far. It is the center of the map, so the biggest intersection of travel. If you were to split every kingdom into equal parts, every single one would contain grassland. Areas of desert like near the Nefarak capital are remote and dead-ends, rarely traveled to in most circumstances for most people..


There is nothing mind boggling about it, and I clarified this very specifically in every post I made regarding 40%. Backpedaling because you are embarrassed about poor reading comprehension doesn't make it any less true. Try opening your map.

Saying something is strong for dwarf on 12% of the map, only while fighting against 2/3 of the races in the game, while simultaneously borrowing 4 squads from humans, is not a useful statement of general balance, and hardly means something is overpowered in general. The difference for humans fighting dwarf on tundra vs what they normally experience is a significant outlier that should be pointed out.

Re: Cheat bombarders ability open fire.

Posted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 9:35 pm
by Lolix
Not back pedaling at all. Your statement about a 40% bonus is entirely inacurate and is based on the assumption that grassland is the default fighting land which it is not in many cases.

Regarding reading comprehension perhaps it is you that is found lacking. You operate under the assumption that this comp is working only on tundra while if you bothered reading the previous posts you would realise that I stated that it is indeed being used off tundra more often that not which by your reasoning places the dwarf at a 40% disadvantage considering he loses his 20% bonus and the human gains 20%. If you want to add to the toll a series of replays were added where the dwarf was at a stat disadvantage and still won with relative ease.

The battles would not be ending without losses if players were not allowed to loan a full front line of swordsmen which can be ressed at the end of the battle ensuring 0 losses. This strategy is being used effectively by numerous players. Wether you believe it possible or not is irrelevant. It is widely used.

I am done discussing this however as you seem to lack the ability to process information and produce an answer pertinent to what has been previously said.

Re: Cheat bombarders ability open fire.

Posted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 10:17 pm
by neuro
What is stronger, gold or silver? without heroes or statistics.

The base of the lich are the scorpions, if they die, the spiders are dead if the mechs are not destroyed, just as if the mechs die, the rockets are dead.

If a dwarf had gold mechs and silver rockets, a lich would win the battle with silver scorpions. The question is that if a dwarf has silver rockets he can not besiege cities and if a lich does not have golden spiders, he is dead.

Spiders are good for killing all kinds of human troop that is not immune to poison. A human with horses is more likely to kill a lich than with swordsmen.

And yes, a level 50 jaq can do 6000k of damage besieging a city. A level 13 rocket with finished level 11 of the academy, can do between 3000 and 4500k damage.

Re: Cheat bombarders ability open fire.

Posted: Sat Feb 17, 2018 12:03 am
by Behindtheed
Lolix wrote:
If you want to add to the toll a series of replays were added where the dwarf was at a stat disadvantage and still won with relative ease.
.


This would be the one relevant piece of information provided by you if it were true. Please show? Infact, anyone losing a fight while being out stated in the 4 categories would be rather amazing to see. I've only seen a few.

Outside of fights on niche terrain corners by off-race of course.


The single biggest problem with the game is the +stat for % gains system. A fight where the stats are close is very rare, and a bunch of clueless players think every fight they see is indicative of balance without looking at the stat page.

Re: Cheat bombarders ability open fire.

Posted: Sat Feb 17, 2018 12:25 am
by Behindtheed
neuro wrote:
[. Mechs are immune to poison and damage to spiders.


Half of spider damage is physical, not poison.

Re: Cheat bombarders ability open fire.

Posted: Sat Feb 17, 2018 7:38 am
by neuro
Behindtheed wrote:
Lolix wrote:
If you want to add to the toll a series of replays were added where the dwarf was at a stat disadvantage and still won with relative ease.
.


This would be the one relevant piece of information provided by you if it were true. Please show? Infact, anyone losing a fight while being out stated in the 4 categories would be rather amazing to see. I've only seen a few.

Outside of fights on niche terrain corners by off-race of course.


The single biggest problem with the game is the +stat for % gains system. A fight where the stats are close is very rare, and a bunch of clueless players think every fight they see is indicative of balance without looking at the stat page.


No one understands the statistics of this game. Graphic example. Lich of level 40 with academy 11 and 12 finished vs dwarf of level 40 with bronze mechs. Advantage of statistics for the lich.


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Re: Cheat bombarders ability open fire.

Posted: Sun Feb 18, 2018 11:17 pm
by Behindtheed
neuro wrote:
Behindtheed wrote:
Lolix wrote:


The single biggest problem with the game is the +stat for % gains system. A fight where the stats are close is very rare, and a bunch of clueless players think every fight they see is indicative of balance without looking at the stat page.



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Stats indeed.

Lich: 105 gold supply 160 silver supply Dwarf: 147 gold supply, 100 bronze supply

What can we learn from this replay? Nothing. Except that stats as usual, dictate the victor.

Re: Cheat bombarders ability open fire.

Posted: Mon Feb 19, 2018 5:11 pm
by neuro
What I want to imply is that the game is badly designed. And nobody understands the bonus of statistics to the troops. The chests and the void has only served to unbalance the game even more. The Chinese only want to earn money and do not take into account any other consideration.

A part are mentally retarded. A level 13 troop of gold in the store can cost you 300 euros, but with the guard towers you can train the same troop in 3 days. The cost of the objects, the experience, and the resources of the power abilities in the store do not have that value in reality. Who will spend 30 euros on 8 magic points if in the void you can get the same in 3 or 4 days?

Re: Cheat bombarders ability open fire.

Posted: Mon Feb 19, 2018 11:02 pm
by Esquire
neuro wrote:
Behindtheed wrote:
neuro wrote:

The most common (48 gold rockets = 96 gold army cap) x (20 silver mechs = 100 army silver cap) x (6 gold spiders x 100 gold army cap) x (35 silver scorpions = 140 silver army cap). The dwarves use less gold army cap to attack and can build more troops. If you add that a level 50 jaq has a damage like 16 gold rockets and that it gives almost 50% more life to the mechs, you already have the answer because the dwarves are so strong.



Now where in the world are you seeing silver mech buffs mattering? Lich can use silver scorps for duels- but a dwarf can not use silver front-line in duels or high lvl garrison attacks. A dwarf can use gold mech front-line if they win the stat bonus in a duel, and probably not lose any. But then again they could probably use just about anything if they win the stat bonus in a duel - mechs just increase the chance of permanent loss.

It's like some of you guys live in a different dimension.


A dwarf is always going to kill a lich because the silver in this game is garbage. A dwarf is always going to do more damage than a lich because it has more than units. The only viable way to kill a dwarf is to have 35 gold scorpions = 140 gold army cap. Mechs are immune to poison and damage to spiders.


I have played Dwarf and Lich extensively, and saying Dwarf beats Lich so matter of factly is just wrong. Even if Dwarves are able to burn down the scorpions, if the scorpions survive long enough to buy the spiders enough time to amass an army of spiderlings, the unit AI will get very distracted and fail to target the spiders. At that point the mechs will be low enough to lose out to the spiders despite taking no poison damage (they still do physical, just not as much), and the spiders will start hitting humanoid backlines and it is pretty much over. The dwarves will be out of ammo and will get overwhelmed.

With the right amount of blasters and snipers Dwarf has a good shot at beating Lich, but it is not guaranteed at all. Dwarf will also take significant mech losses doing so, while all the Lich units will revive if 100% injury rate. I've beaten Lich as Dwarf, but I've also lost. I've beaten Dwarf as Lich, and I don't recall ever losing as Lich against a Dwarf.

Also, an optimized lich can field 7 spiders for 105 gold cap, and then build gold scorpions with the excess. At end game with 150+ cap you can easily get a couple stacks of gold scorpions and 7 spiders. Lich are quite cap efficient for PvP.